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[#13] Linn LP12 Fans    
Billtube,
I am newee in LP12, shame that have never had so different top stuff as per mentioned.......:-(
Hope one day would achieve them (tone arms, power supply....) one by one.
uat506
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.78
2007-05-10 23:15
[#14] Linn LP12 Fans    
When you do the comparison between Valhalla and Origin live DC motor, properly your Valhalla had been used for around 20 years without any restoration. The three electrolytic capacitors lack of energy to drive your motor. The consequences are obvious. I like to do the blind test with our own ears. However, theoretical is equaled important. If you agree the speed accuracy is crucial to the playback of music, crystal oscillator is essential to achieve that accuracy. DC motor using voltage to control the speed by simply applies an IC chip 7809 together with a variable potentiometer.
Imagine when you play radio control motor car, when you press the button harder, and its speed getting faster.
Lingo, this is a very smart design, but not worth that much. Theoretically, a more advance op amp is being use to enhance the output waveform driving the motor,
The latter version which applied surface mounts technology, no doubt the noise would be much lower. I can say it is much better the earlier long box version.
If people say the earlier version Valhalla is better, I hope people make that statement would provide some fact to support it.

Blue-ray
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.66
2007-05-10 23:24
[#15] Linn LP12 Fans    
hello, I'm a LP12 user too.. may I ask anyone who play with Linto as well? What do you think by using Linto compare to other brand?
Thanks
holein1
個人訊息 正式會員
222.xxx.xxx.32
2007-05-10 23:34
[#16] Linn LP12 Fans    
I actually did the comparisons with the Lingo as well as the Vahalla where the three capacitors had been replaced with new ones on the circuit board prior to the experiment. I had known that the Vahalla would not have been in the same league as either the Lingo or the Origin Live which I also had been sceptical about the ability of its DC motor, but the outcome really astonished me and all my friends who were also taking part in the listening. Recently, I have replaced the Vahalla on one of my turntables with the Hercules and the improvement in sound is worth every cent I spent on it. I am now thinking to house the Vahalla and the Hercules into two separate enclosures so I can use either, as I wish or use the Vahalla for my AR Legend turntable.
As regarding to speed accuracy, which is essential to a good turntable but speed accuracy alone does not guarantee good sound, otherwise all direct drive quartz locked turntables should sound good but unfortunately that is not the case. There are other factors, such as material and its tolerance, electronic & mechanical intergration, resistance to vibrations and interference etc., which can also affect the performance of a turntable.
I would like to point out that I did not say that the Vahalla was better but some people prefer its sound. One man’s meat is another one’s poison.
Best regards
KCC123
個人訊息 會員
88.xxx.xxx.181
2007-05-11 09:30
[#17] Linn LP12 Fans    
The LP12 die hard fan should be relax and enjoy what you like, try to keep an open mind on different opinion, I believe everyone here loves their LP12, just try to share their own experience.

Uat, I am in Hong Kong, same city?

rover901
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.47
2007-05-11 09:42
[#18] Linn LP12 Fans    
Rover, agree with you! Share with your thought and experience of our LP12 enjoyment is what we do, aim to maximize your LP12 perfection in your own preference.

I am in KLCC at the moment (not HK).
uat506
個人訊息 會員
210.xxx.xxx.66
2007-05-11 10:26
[#19] Linn LP12 Fans    
Linn has announced that a SE version of LP12 will be forthcoming soon.
嚦嚦二世
個人訊息 會員
203.xxx.xxx.126
2007-05-11 10:30
[#20] Linn LP12 Fans    
KCC123, Thanks for your information. I ‘d very much appreciate you are making comments based on experiment . I wish I could try that origin live DC motor if I have a chance.
"direct drive quartz locked turntables should sound good but unfortunately that is not"
That is true, due to the motor shaft connected to the platter directly, therefore space between the shaft and bearing is essential to keep it spin smoothly without overheated the motor, but it bring about the vow and flutter problem. However, Technic SP-10 is the direct drive turntable still very popular among die hard LP fans.
I totally agree with you that "electronic & mechanical integrations, resistance to vibrations and interference " is crucial factors affecting the performance of turntable. Dennis told me that the father of designer of LP12 used to work for Rolls and Royce. Therefore, he knows very well how to design the best bearings and platter for LP12.
As to Linto, if you are considering using Linn MC cartridge, this is the best choice. I read an article saying that the Linto was design for Linn MC Cartridges, therefore, the input impedance selector was eliminated. The selection was hard wired inside, the sound path is more direct with less components. We did a test with other phono amp and MC step up transformers. With Linn cartridge, the winner was Linto.
Blue-ray
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.66
2007-05-11 10:49
[#21] Linn LP12 Fans    
嚦嚦二世
LP12 SE is probably a LP12 equipped with a keel sub chassis and a Ekos SE tonearm as well as a new baseboard

regarding PS for a turntable, an article I read said the origin live PS kit(may be applicable to other TT PS) keeps stable current to DC motor, and entertains extra power needs caused by extra drag force induce by stylus when playing loud passage of a song.....something like that, I am not sure i understand that correctly or remember that correctly....maybe that's why the expensive PS(be it lingo or ....etc) can make better sound and different sound...?

regarding supports for LP12, english suggest light table or wall mount support.....some said never use heavy rack under LP12.....any experience/thoughts to share?
rover901
個人訊息 會員
203.xxx.xxx.71
2007-05-11 21:32
[#22] Linn LP12 Fans    

Dennis told me that the father of designer of LP12 used to work for Rolls and Royce. Therefore, he knows very well how to design the best bearings and platter for LP12.
_________________________________________________________________________________________________

Blue-ray,

How does the father working in Rolls Royce related to the son making bearings? I worked for a well-known engineering company but my son is a musician, knows a zilch about engineering.

And is Rolls Royce well known for bearings? I was told the chassis for Rolls Royce was from Volvo and the suspensions from Citroen.



cpsjj
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.77
2007-05-11 21:47
[#23] Linn LP12 Fans    
CP,
The most popular weg site for Linn LP12 fans are as follow:
I copy an abstract for your reading.

http://www.n.mackie.btinternet.co.uk/linn/tlp12faq.html#history

"There used to be another saying that " Hamish Robertson who designed the Ariston RD11 was by nature a drinking man and not an entrepreneur. There came into his life a certain Ivor Tiefenbrun who suggested that his fathers' firm, from memory I think was called Castle Engineering, could machine parts for the Ariston turntable. Hamish accepted the offer and soon the product rolled of Ivor's production line."

When Dennis told me that, I have reason to believe that Castle Engineering was one of Rolls Royce vendor which supply parts to Rolls Royce. I recall form my mind that I used to read an article on the net which saying something how it related with Rolls Royce. I couldn’t find it this time.
Dennis , please supplement the missing part. Thanks.
Blue-ray
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.66
2007-05-11 22:58
[#24] Linn LP12 Fans    

Blue-ray,

Picture showing Jack Yan Tiefenbrun (second from right), founder of Castle Precision Engineering (Glasgow) Limited and Textile Engineering Company, and of course father of Ivor Tiefenbrun.

Castle is a subcontractor of Rolls Royce, National Nuclear Energy Authority, British Aerospace ...... supplying tools, production jigs etc. There are quite a number of these precision engineering firms just like the plastic die & mold making shops in Tsuen Wan back in the 70's in Hong Kong. Just one precision lathe or milling machine will do the job. Of course nowadays we all talk about CNC, jig borer etc. But even the machine shop in my son's school has a 5-1/2 axis CNC jig borer. What I'm saying is there is nothing special about Ivor Tiefenbrun having a connection with such shop nor will this add any credibility to Linn as all other turntable manufacturers are using this kind of shops. The success of LP12 does not lie in its bearing or its machining quality.


cpsjj
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.77
2007-05-11 23:51
[#25] Linn LP12 Fans    
I have replaced the stock power cord of my Hercules powered Linn LP12 with a DIY cable made of 5N pure silver wires terminated in IeGO pure silver AC plug. The external tonearm cable for the Ittok has also been changed with a DIY silver/gold alloy one with silver Bullet plugs. Now, the combination has lifted the performance of this turntable comparable to a Lingo powered LP12 with Ekos. I still could not figure out why the silver power cable has advanced the overall performance of the AC motor to another high level in sound quality? This has not been my illusion or imagination but evidence supported by lengthy and repeated listening. I am looking forward to finding a suitable tonearm wire for making a continuous length of cable running from the cartridge tags to phono plugs to see how much performance I can further improve to the Ittok?

KCC123
個人訊息 會員
88.xxx.xxx.181
2007-05-12 08:38
[#26] Linn LP12 Fans    
KXX123, How does the silver power cable improves the sound of your LP12? your LP12 looks very nice. What cartridge/phono combination are you using?
rover901
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.47
2007-05-12 09:26
[#27] Linn LP12 Fans    
:-)
http://www.stereo.net.au/forum/uploads/post-1288-1161416062_thumb.jpg
uat506
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.40
2007-05-12 11:24
[#28] Linn LP12 Fans    
uat, nice setup.


rover901
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.47
2007-05-12 11:40
[#29] Linn LP12 Fans    
At the moment I am using an AT OC9 cartridge on that particular turntable with a Salience phono stage. I think the Salience surpasses the performance of the Era Gold & ESP combination and others in many respects.
The silver power cable improves upon the stock cable in every area, especially the overall transparency and solidity, minute details in the treble, mid band clarity and expressiveness, bass power, control and definition and better imaging and sound stage. It seems the silver cable alone advances the performance of the stock Vahalla LP12, to such extent, that you may think a Lingo is being used instead and the huge improvement is beyond my expectations. My modification/upgrade with the power and tonearm cables might not be approved by many Linn owners and dealers but any one who has the courage to explore will find it rewarding after all.
KCC123
個人訊息 會員
88.xxx.xxx.181
2007-05-12 17:15
[#30] Linn LP12 Fans    
kcc123

I am not a "linn-factory-approved-only" believer, but still find it quite interesting to hear a power cable brings such huge effects on valhalla power supply....while silver tonearm cable improves sounds of the system is within expectation.

how do you support your LP12?
rover901
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.216
2007-05-13 12:09
[#31] Linn LP12 Fans    
I used to use a Target stand for the deck but I have recently put it on a different equipment rack with a 20mm. piece of slate on top. The slate is a natural material composed of multiple sedimentary layers and is denser and stable than wood. It has properties which are ideal for damping and insulation purposes and considered by many to be superior to marbles and other stones. Now, even World Designs has come up with a Slatedeck Plinth for the Garrard and Lenco turntables. I am still evaluating it at the moment but the impressions have been good so far.
KCC123
個人訊息 會員
88.xxx.xxx.181
2007-05-13 20:19
[#32] Linn LP12 Fans    
I always hear that the LP12 should be placed on light weight support(rack), I am not sure whether this only applies to UK users where they usually have wobble wooden floor instead of concret floor we have in HK. Some LP12 friends in UK suggest Ikea LACK coffee table, I use it and find the sound of LP12 more"relax" but lost some speed and bass attack......Of course the quality of LACK is a factor that downgraded the sound of my LP12 in some ways. The question is whether LP12 should be place on light weight rack based on what theory?
rover901
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.45
2007-05-14 20:47
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