影音天地主旨 ﹝請按主旨作出回應﹞  下頁  尾頁 寄件者 傳送日期 由舊至新 由新至舊
[#29] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
firstly, sorry for my rudeness sin....

I realy wonder if someone can hear the difference. I hope we can arrange a blind test...

Is it ok to you..?
Thank you very much for your help..
hiphopzz
個人訊息 會員
59.xxx.xxx.60
2009-11-12 10:34
[#30] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    

不用好的器材, 反相是很容易聽到的, 我做了一段反相的錄音, 已 upload 到 youtube. 在的的平價電腦 speaker 都聽到分別:

原本的錄音:



反相的錄音:


(這錄音是從唱片翻錄的, 版權期限是 50 年, 因此, 翻錄 50 年前所發行的唱片是合法的)

patrickwong
個人訊息 會員
221.xxx.xxx.94
2009-11-12 12:05
[#31] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
Can I clarify if we are talking about out-of-phase or inverted phase..?


patrickwong c-hing,

thank you for your help..!!
but my company block youtube so I will try at home tonight..

thanks again.. ^^

hiphopzz
個人訊息 會員
59.xxx.xxx.60
2009-11-12 13:03
[#32] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
嚴格來講, 相位 (Phase) 這個術語有點被誤用, 一般我們講的「反相」是指 Stereo 左右兩條聲軌其中一條 Polarity 反了, 亦即我們通常講的 out-of-phase 。
patrickwong
個人訊息 會員
221.xxx.xxx.124
2009-11-12 13:41
[#33] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
patrickwong c-hing,

yes, it always confusing....
I suppose many c-hings here are talking about invert phase...


Let me clarify my position sin....

out-of-phase:
If any one CANNOT hear the difference please cut your head....

inverted phase:
If any one can hear the difference, I cut my head for you to seat....

XD
hiphopzz
個人訊息 會員
59.xxx.xxx.60
2009-11-12 14:00
[#34] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
For a good hifi system, NOT EXPENSIVE SYSTEM, everyone should hear the difference between 0 phase and 180 phase!!
_____________________________________________
hiphopzz c-hing

That's the point. Yes, NOT out-of-phase, inverted phase (0 degree to 180 degree). If you are familiar with classical music, your system is well presenting the recording, you can hear this. Even though a non-audiophile guy (my wife) can hear the different. When the phase is correct, first you hear more airy from wood winds, you hear more details from violins, the position of all musical instruments can be clearly identify its position in the orchestra. Many many to prove but my poor English can describe this. So that that I don't know how to type Chinese using PC.
classicalbug
個人訊息 會員
210.xxx.xxx.21
2009-11-12 14:08
[#35] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
聽返正相好多功夫?
-----------------------------------------
唔係吖!把喇叭線紅黑反轉,相位便馬上反轉了!
Pilotrol
個人訊息 會員
221.xxx.xxx.180
2009-11-12 14:13
[#36] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
No need to argue and cut your heads. They are all physics and engineering. Just draw out all the graphs can prove whether different sound will be produced.
oldbird
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.142
2009-11-12 14:27
[#37] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
反o左相o既聲有點似雲遊太空咁,虛虛浮浮,唔夠實淨
sherman1215
個人訊息 會員
118.xxx.xxx.165
2009-11-12 15:36
[#38] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    

6moons.com - Fazed About Polarity and Phase ?

http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/polarity/polarity.html

"Absolute polarity. In phase. Sometimes audiophiles get confused. Which is which? Absolute polarity means that a leading edge is heard as a positive pressure wave or compression (higher density), not a negative wave or rarefaction (lower density or decompression). ......"

digitalstereo
個人訊息 會員
219.xxx.xxx.160
2009-11-12 15:48
[#39] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    

hiphopzz hing,

"inverted phase:
If any one can hear the difference, I cut my head for you to seat.."

Every time when I press the "Phase" button of my DAC, I can hear the difference.

With absolute polarity of the CD, the bass will be more solid, the voice will be more sweet and the treble will be more clear.

But you can keep your head for your own use - just joking :=)

Happing listening


digitalstereo
個人訊息 會員
219.xxx.xxx.160
2009-11-12 15:56
[#40] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    

My DAC



digitalstereo
個人訊息 會員
219.xxx.xxx.160
2009-11-12 15:57
[#41] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
oldbird c-hing,

are you talking about inverted phase...?
I just know out-of-phase can cancel sound from each speakers and sounds "hollow"...

Pls tell me theory behind for inverted phase...

Thousand of thanks.. ^^

......................................................................................................


digitalstereo c-hing,

If you are sure there is difference, I really hope we can arrange blind test..

Honestly, I really appreciate if you can help..

Thousand of thanks.. again.. ^^
hiphopzz
個人訊息 會員
59.xxx.xxx.60
2009-11-12 16:27
[#42] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    

http://www.herronaudio.com/images/Polarity.pdf

Go to page two and you can read this.

"Is Absolute Polarity Absolute ?

Considerations from an Engineering Perspective

By Keith Herron"



digitalstereo
個人訊息 會員
219.xxx.xxx.160
2009-11-12 16:36
[#43] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
呢件附件雖然用黎測試喇叭相位,但另一角度諗,即係可以測試cd是否反相錄音......

http://gato-shop.com/en/phase-it-39/phase-it-99.html
wowow
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.117
2009-11-12 16:56
[#44] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
digitalstereo c-hing,

Thank you very much for your sharing.

I read it and briefly conclude 2 points from it.
Design of speaker and inserting a unity gain phase inverter

The first point may be relevant since different phase of driver. Reversing phase may give more coherent phase.

But the second point,I think, is quite unrelevant...

Any c-hing can share idea..? ^^
hiphopzz
個人訊息 會員
59.xxx.xxx.60
2009-11-12 17:19
[#45] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
> 呢件附件雖然用黎測試喇叭相位,但另一角度諗,
> 即係可以測試cd是否反相錄音......
This device cannot help to find out "cd是否反相錄音". It can only tell whether the 'physical connection' of the speakers is correct (check the correct polarity of the speakers). There are many simple ways to check the polarity of speakers (or the systems). No need to buy this expensive device for such simple task.


最後修改時間: 2009-11-12 17:21:39
patrickwong
個人訊息 會員
221.xxx.xxx.30
2009-11-12 17:20
[#46] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
hiphopzz hing,
yes, I am talking about "inverted phase". I just recall when I did experiment in the U on feedback/control systems, plotting input/output graphs on the motions/signals, comparing the distortion and phase shift of the input/output.

People are concerned on the inverted phase because the speaker suppose will push out the cone will become suck in. People claim that they can hear the difference and the sound will be better if the polarity is correct. However, sound is reproduced by a series of vibrations , i.e. in and out motions of the speaker cone. What effect will be on the sound produced with inverted phase? I don't know and have not auditioned it before. If some C-hing has experience on this, please share. What I can imagine (from an input of a simple sine wave and cause the speaker cone to move) is just a time shift of the motion. It is still a sine wave.
To my limited knowledge on electronics, different frequency will have different phase shift in the same circuit. So, does it really have effect with just making a 180 deg phase change ? It may also inverted some frequency incorrectly?
oldbird
個人訊息 會員
202.xxx.xxx.142
2009-11-12 18:08
[#47] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
JBL 的舊喇叭全是反相的,好多用家都照聽冇去反番正佢。
孟波
個人訊息 會員
218.xxx.xxx.240
2009-11-12 21:41
[#48] 好多cd 都是反相錄音, 聽返正相好多功夫, 有簡單解決 ?    
係唔係反相錄音. 一般聆聽都冇問題.
如果冇資料話比你知隻碟既錄音係反相錄音定係正相錄音.
你聽唔聽得出隻碟係乜相錄音.

其實果d 音響器材有指示輸入輸出既相位, 作用係比d 錄音工程師連接器材及混音錄音時張d 相位搞清楚才開工. 確保錄音/混音出來相位正確.
PLL
個人訊息 會員
203.xxx.xxx.157
2009-11-12 21:57
主旨內容一共有 5 頁,每頁顯示 20 個信息,選擇頁數:  下頁  尾頁
按照傳送日期顯示:由舊至新由舊至新  由新至舊由新至舊
最新資訊 - 影音
Heco 推出全新二路書架喇叭 Bella Donna 2021-12-04

最新資訊 - 影音
全港首個 Meyer Sound Dolby ATMOS 系統家庭影院示範會後記 2021-12-03

最新資訊 - 影音
KECES 推出全新線性電源供應器 P28 2021-12-01

最新資訊 - 影音
CAMBRIDGE AUDIO 2021 舊換新 TRADE-IN 計劃 2021-12-01