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| [#5209] Harbeth同好會 One more member became Lavry's user. Should we have to amend our name with Harbeth and Lavry fans club? ha ha...講笑... Recently, I paid more effort to my home renovation, and got much pressure from myself. 無計啦! 自已做呢行, 加上有一個完美的盼望, 從設計、成本控制、選料及施工管理都希望在預計之內。現hifi插座已從總電箱直接供應，layout亦有小許修改，balance家庭、囝囝和聽野的環境...講真要做到好似M40兄的聽野環境, 小弟有點困難, 但有可能有點接近。Finally, I am planning to buy a solid steel hifi rack which is more value for money for long term investment, 及希望"一步到位". After completion of the renovation, I really want to invite you for home visit and help me to fine-tune my system. pls. see the photos about the renovation in facebook (e-mail; cchome_co@yahoo.com.hk). |
cchome_co 正式會員203.xxx.xxx.68 |
2009-09-30 10:12 | |
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| [#5210] Harbeth同好會 Dear All ching, I am a new user of Harbeth. i bought the P3ESR for 2 months. after these 2 months runin, i still feel that not 通透 and 開揚 enough. Here is my system CDT - Stello CDT100 DAC - Stello DA100 AMP - Sysnthesis Seamus Tube AMP (4 x 6189 + 4 x EL34) Would like to know if anyway i can improve. |
manangus 正式會員 219.xxx.xxx.40 |
2009-09-30 13:24 |
| [#5211] Harbeth同好會 cchome hing, for solid steel rack, you are better consider at least their 6 series. i am using 5 series and frankly speaking, it sound similiar to a china made clone hi fi rack that i'm using also. but in fact, 6 series is not cheap i doubt if it is worth its price. beside solid steel, finite elemente also very nice. take a look to their "entry-level" rack:  |
gneonhk 正式會員 210.xxx.xxx.224 |
2009-09-30 13:55 |
| [#5212] Harbeth同好會 forget about the link: http://www.finite-elemente.de/en/racks/pagode_signature/features and a new version released also. much more beauty but i dare to think they are not cheap... http://www.finite-elemente.de/en/racks/pagode_edition  |
gneonhk 正式會員 210.xxx.xxx.224 |
2009-09-30 13:57 |
| [#5213] Harbeth同好會 cchome hing, i agree FE rack is closest to "一步到位", you'd be probably using it for many years, but it's a VERY big step in terms of $$. |
mahi 正式會員 218.xxx.xxx.148 |
2009-09-30 14:46 |
| [#5214] Harbeth同好會 Hi agentsmittie hing, Sorry I am not a Harberth user but I am interested about your Weiss DAC2. If I don't use a computer, can I feed music files to the Weiss from a NAS? I know setting up you will need a computer but what about normal use? Can you control the music flow from a NAS -＞ DAC -＞ Amp with a handheld devise? |
demio99 正式會員 203.xxx.xxx.231 |
2009-09-30 16:11 |
| [#5215] Harbeth同好會 manugas hing, i dunno what speakers you listened below, but the material used in the tweeter has a distinct effect on how high notes are played. those metal or ribbon type will always sound more transparent or open. but some may find those too hard sounding. i myself find harbeth quite transparent among UK made speakers. in terms of 'air' though, then yes there's usually a little bit roll off among UK speakers, in order to get long term listening pleasure. you may want to experience a bit on the cabling or tubes to arrive at what you like. |
mahi 正式會員 218.xxx.xxx.148 |
2009-09-30 17:36 |
| [#5216] Harbeth同好會 Should the entry level rack from FE be the "Spider"?  |
m30 正式會員 203.xxx.xxx.231 |
2009-09-30 20:36 |
| [#5217] Harbeth同好會 ＞＞Sorry I am not a Harberth user but I am interested about your Weiss DAC2. If I don't use a computer, can I feed music files to the Weiss from a NAS? I know setting up you will need a computer but what about normal use? Can you control the music flow from a NAS -＞ DAC -＞ Amp with a handheld devise? The Weiss DAC by itself cannot play music without a music player, which could be a computer, a CD player or any device that has one of the following outputs: 1. Firewire - From a computer (PC or Macbook) 2. SPDIF (Coaxial) - From a CD player, media player such Squeezebox/Transporter or computer with a sound card with coaxial out 3. SPDIF (fiber) - Same types of devices as above except with fiber out 4. AES/EBU - Same types of devices as above except with AES/EBU XLR out You can connect up some of these devices into a NAS. I have used Squeezeboxes and Transporter media players with a NAS service serving music without a computer. But you need a media player like Squeezebox for that. Another alternative, which in my experience gets the best sound out of the Weiss DAC, is to connect a PC to the Weiss DAC via Firewire. You can map the music folder to a NAS, but the PC or Mac needs to be turned on. If you use iTunes, you can use an iPod Touch or iPhone using a app called "Remote", so you dont have to touch the computer to access your music. In my experience, the Firewire connection is vastly superior to the SPDIF. |
agentsmittie 正式會員 219.xxx.xxx.247 |
2009-10-01 00:05 |
| [#5218] Harbeth同好會 ptholeo hing, good choice, really good DAC for the money, nice to hear another member enjoy DA11 as much as I do. remember to post photos of your system :) cchome, ready for home visit? regarding hifi rack, Solid steel is something you will not lose much in terms of money, but don't expect night and day difference to a solid wooden rack. FE must be great, but personally I find it a bit crazy to spend more than 10k(FE top model is far more expensive than 10k, btw) on a hifi rack. If I have to spend upto 10k for a hifi rack, i would rather buy some better equipments/LPs :) |
rover901 正式會員 116.xxx.xxx.107 |
2009-10-01 13:48 |
| [#5219] Harbeth同好會 thx m30 hing. i forget the spider series. but i think the signature series may be their "serious" entry level product. rover hing, personally i agree with that. 10k+ for a 3 shelves hi fi rack seems a bit crazy. but from the user review, they do need not to place any "expensive" spike under the gear after they use FE. given it is easy to cost us 2-3K for a set of used "good" spike, the price of FE seems reasonable then. and most important, its outlook win solid steel a nathan road and a better declaration for new renovation house.^_^ btw, miss u guy very much. when will we have a gathering? a "blow water" gathering is also fine for me. ^^ |
gneonhk 正式會員 203.xxx.xxx.232 |
2009-10-01 15:40 |
| [#5220] Harbeth同好會 my take is that if you foresee yourself will eventually be crazy enough to own system that cost 100k or more, then investing in a 10k rack early on is okay la. you're not gonna change your rack for a long time. but i also agree with rover hing that budget spent on gear 1st will deliver most return. so cchome hing if you have dream gear in mind then that should be your priority. |
mahi 正式會員 218.xxx.xxx.126 |
2009-10-01 16:21 |
| [#5221] Harbeth同好會 Yes I think the operating word here is priority. Given that for most of us funding is not unlimited. I never understood the technology behind FE products and why they cost what they cost/ I saw gneonhk using Ceraballs, what is their concept and what magic do they perform? Given that I am going full on digital and there is almost no moving parts in my hifi rack, would it still improve any of my components? And which component would need the most help? (e.g. Pre, Power, DAC, Power Supplies) And how about the speakers? Harbeths are designed to be resonant, so putting ceraballs underneath them be counterproductive? |
agentsmittie 正式會員 219.xxx.xxx.247 |
2009-10-01 16:33 |
| [#5222] Harbeth同好會 any bro using the Naim FRAIM (see photo below) or MANA rack ?  |
h2005 正式會員 203.xxx.xxx.192 |
2009-10-01 17:28 |
| [#5223] Harbeth同好會 you can do a very simple experiment to answer your questions. just pull your preamp out, try put it on anything you can find in your house that are made of different elements, wood, metal, glass, carpet, plastic, etc. i did that and find there's difference and some surfaces work better than others in my house. then comes the difficult part, decide what you want better, remember keeping status quo is already an implicit decision :P |
mahi 正式會員 218.xxx.xxx.126 |
2009-10-01 17:35 |
| [#5224] Harbeth同好會 smittie hing, or maybe you should try your weiss dac 2 first as it's light and easy to move around. |
mahi 正式會員 218.xxx.xxx.126 |
2009-10-01 17:39 |
| [#5225] Harbeth同好會 Yes I figure the DAC would be the first candidate. Currently I have run out or rack and made some decks using acrylic sheets, and the DAC2 is sitting on one of those, above my HiCap. I am thinking of rearranging the whole thing, a lot of work though. |
agentsmittie 正式會員 219.xxx.xxx.247 |
2009-10-01 18:16 |
| [#5226] Harbeth同好會 Gneonhk Hing, You are correct, the spider cannot be classified as a proper FE. The signature series is the proper entry level. Someone is selling 3 level signature @ HK$9,500, or the master series @ HK$30,000 for one rack in r33 |
m30 正式會員 203.xxx.xxx.231 |
2009-10-01 19:43 |
| [#5227] Harbeth同好會 Why tonal control on preamp is indispensable? A. Shaw (Designer of Harbeth)文: Just to clarify .... 1. The SHL5 has a 'generous'. warm bass as you say. 2. No amount of substitution of cables, stands, electronics will change the basic fact that the SHL5 produces more low frequency energy. You're wasting your time and money chasing that one. 3. That extra low frequency energy is at the heart of the SHL5s sound. You may find that in an absorptive room the speakers energy and the room's absorption are in perfect harmony. 4. There are really three approaches if you wish to reduce the low frequency energy in a room. a) increase the absorption of LF in the room (more soft furnishings) and/or b) turn down the volume or c) reduce the amount of bass energy being delivered to the speaker. c) implies some sort of graphic equaliser or tone control. Almost every real room in the real world with real speakers could benefit from a little EQ at low frequencies. One of the greatest mysteries and acts of insanity in the audio business was the deletion of tone controls from hifi amplifiers from about the 1980s with some utterly discreditable mumbo jumbo that 'tone controls are no part of a hifi system'. I can categorically assure you that a properly designed and executed tone control circuit does not degrade the signal quality and never has done; this is extremely easy to prove under blind listening conditions*. Tone controls were deleted from hifi amps as a marketing gimmick to attract a new 'minimalist' consumer away from amps laden with buttons and controls. Perhaps the greatest intellect in amplifier design was the late Peter Walker of QUAD. Key point: he was an expert on both amplifiers and loudspeakers, and designed for real rooms. He knew from measurement and listening how real rooms corrupted even the most carefully designed speaker response at low frequencies and obviously, putting high fidelity first, made sure that his amplifiers always gave the user the ability to tune the speaker to the room - via the tone or tilt control. How many amplifier designers know anything about speakers? How many actually measure speakers in real domestic rooms? How many are obsessed with chasing ludicrously (and needlessly) low noise and distortion figures to 0.0000% when the room corrupts the low frequencies by 50-500%? As I live in the real world and know only too well from measurement how all rooms disturb my designed nice smooth low frequency response, I can say that personally, the only amplifier I would myself be really happy to use in my untreated room at home would be fitted with a bypassable tone (or better, tilt) control. Those controls would, in practice, give me a sporting chance that I could make any speaker work in just about any room. They'd save me the inconvenience and cost of treating the room. They are 100% wife friendly. However, handicapped by the fact that 'audiophiles' consider tone control to be anathema, I have to listen during the design stage with bypassed tone controls to represent what most users experience. * I would also suggest that if you realise just how much 'eq' is applied to every LP, broadcast, DVD, CD you've ever heard (are there any which are not twiddled in some way?) it would put the angst concerning amplifier tone controls into proper perspective. In short: if your amp has a tone control you are more likely to get the best overall fidelity because you can tune the speaker/room interface to suit you. Tone controls empower you not some marketeer who has decided on your behalf that tone controls are evil. Attached two adverts from 1956 for amplifiers featuring tone controls. The physics of real speakers in real rooms have not changed in fifty years so why have tone controls been deleted from all but a few domestic hifi amplifiers? What is the engineering logic behind that? This has always seemed to me the act of the greatest illogicality in our industry. http://www.harbeth.co.uk/usergroup/showthread.php?p=3945 --------------------------------------- SHL5轟轟叫? Shaw 對80年代以來擴大機設計取消 tone control 提出批評. 設計良好的 tone control 不會降低訊號品質, Shaw以QUAD 的Peter Walker 為例, 因為他同時是擴大機和喇叭的專家, 他知道再好的喇叭設計也不能解決真實房間裡低頻問題, 所有他設計的擴大機都有讓用家調整的tone 或 tilt control 功能. 簡單的說,假如你的擴大機有 tone control, 你更有可能得到更傳真的聲音. http://www.myav.com.tw/bbs/showthread.php?s=63a3aba301329c06ca4c5b8613dcb623&threadid=18051&perpage=12&pagenumber=470  |
george1977 正式會員 61.xxx.xxx.107 |
2009-10-01 20:02 |
| [#5228] Harbeth同好會 Thanks agentsmittie hing. You mage it very clear for me. |
demio99 正式會員 58.xxx.xxx.139 |
2009-10-01 23:32 |
